Witnesses /

Manuel Pedro Marto

Seer's familyVillager

Manuel Pedro Marto, born 1873 in Fátima (aged 44), of Aljustrel, father of Francisco and Jacinta; he married Olímpia de Jesus in 1898.

From Aljustrel, FátimaFátima parish (locals)Attitude beforehand: Believer4 passages · 13 July 1917, 13 August 1917, Other 1917 events, 13 September 1917, 13 October 1917
13 JulFirst-handPartlySworn depositionSeers' words overheardTemperature dropCrowd scene
English

On the thirteenth of July the parents also went to the Cova da Iria, the children going on ahead. A man of the parish named Matias, a barber2, on seeing the children's father, called him over to the holm oak where his wife already was. The three seers always went together. At first they remained standing, then they knelt, Lúcia having told people to close the umbrellas that were open because of the sun. Most of the people were behind the seers. And at a certain moment these stood up and then knelt down again. They heard a voice coming from the spot by the holm-oak shrub which said: – “What do you want of me today?” She waited a moment and then said: “So you want nothing of me today?” Lúcia said, and the father heard it: “What I wanted – oh! Our Lady!”, and asked for the cure and conversion of various people, the father not remembering their names.

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Lúcia then added: “she says that not all of them will get better, because some are wicked”. She further declared that the Lady had said that they should all pray the rosary and that the war would soon end. The children were then kneeling; Lúcia got up quickly, her dress billowing out like a balloon, and said, pointing: “Look over there, if you want to see her” – and immediately added: “You're already too late”. She was facing almost to the west and turned towards the east to point to the Lady, who was withdrawing. It was very hot and soon afterwards the weather turned cool. As soon as they stood up, many people asked questions, took twigs from the holm-oak shrub and questioned the children. The father picked Jacinta up in his arms to get through the crowd more easily. She said she had seen Our Lady again.

Português (original)

Em treze de julho os pais foram também à Cova da Iria, indo as crianças adiante. Um indivíduo da freguesia, de nome Matias, barbeiro2, ao ver o pai das crianças, chamou-o para junto da azinheira onde já estava a mulher. Os três videntes iam sempre juntos. A princípio conservaram-se de pé, depois ajoelharam, tendo a Lúcia mandado fechar os chapéus que estavam abertos por causa do sol. O povo estava na sua maior parte por trás dos videntes. E estes num dado momento levantaram-se e depois tornaram a ajoelhar-se. Ouviram uma voz vinda do local ao pé da carrasqueira que disse: – “Que me quereis hoje?” Esperou um momento e depois disse: “Então não me quereis hoje nada?” A Lúcia disse, o que o pai ouviu: “Eu o que queria – ai! Nossa Senhora!”, e pediu a cura e a conversão de diversas pessoas, não se recordando o pai o nome delas.

A Lúcia depois acrescentou: “diz que nem todas melhoram, porque algumas são más”. Declarou ainda que a Senhora tinha dito que rezassem todos o terço e que a guerra em breve ia acabar. Estavam então as crianças de joelhos, a Lúcia levantou-se rapidamente, ficando o vestido em balão, e disse apontando: “Olhem para acolá, se a querem ver” – e acrescentou logo: “Já não vão a tempo”. Ela estava voltada quase ao poente e voltou-se para o nascente a indicar a Senhora que se retirava. Fazia muita calma e logo depois o tempo tornou-se fresco. Logo que elas se levantaram, muitas pessoas fizeram perguntas, tiraram raminhos da carrasqueira e interrogaram as crianças. O pai pegou na Jacinta ao colo para atravessar mais facilmente por entre a multidão. Ela disse ter visto outra vez Nossa Senhora.

Editor's notes (1)

2 Manuel Rodrigues Matias. He was considered a man skilled in curing ailments. He was in charge of the Civil Registry Office, which operated in his house at Amoreira.

2 Manuel Rodrigues Matias. Era considerado um homem entendido na cura de maleitas. Era o encarregado do Posto do Registo Civil, que funcionava em sua casa, na Amoreira.

DCF Seleção, Doc. 80 (= DCF II, Doc. 4) · interrogation · 28 Sep 1923 (6 years later)View scans (2)Link
13 AugOther 1917First-handSaw itSworn depositionThunder / noiseCloud / smoke columnStar / luminous globeCrowd scene
English

On the thirteenth of August he went to the field to fetch maize, intending to go to the place at the proper hour, and learned, when he was already on the threshing floor, from Florinda3, that the administrator had meanwhile arrived at his house. It was not yet ten o'clock. He went straight back home and found the administrator and a priest4 whom he did not know. The administrator asked: “Well, Mr Marto, do you know why I've come here today? I want to go up there to the Cova da Iria, to the Miracle, I want to go and see. I'm like Saint Thomas: seeing is believing”. Manuel Marto said: “You do well, Mr Administrator”. The latter declared that he would take the children in his carriage. They were still out with the cattle. Marto asked his wife to call them, because it was time. She did not get to call them, but they came with the cattle. Lúcia, learning that the administrator was at her uncle and aunt's house, went there at once, and he, as soon as he saw her, told her that he would take them in the carriage, to which she replied that they would not go by carriage. The little girl went back home and then came with her father. On that occasion there was talk of a secret. As the road had not been built, the carriage waited at a crossroads. The administrator said that in that case he would wait for them at Fátima to ask them some questions at the house of the parish priest.

The parents of the three children went to the parish priest's house, the administrator not yet being there; he arrived shortly afterwards. They all stayed on the veranda. Only Lúcia was called inside to be questioned by the parish priest in the presence of the administrator.

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After the interrogation, the administrator invited the children to come down the steps of the veranda and get into the trap in which he had come, drove round the church and fled to Vila Nova de Ourém. Jacinta's father then went on to the Cova da Iria, astonished at the administrator's departure. At the Cova da Iria, after talking with various people, he clearly heard a loud bang followed by dust and mist. The people fled. Almost everyone took off their hats, cried out to Our Lady and were very happy, saying that they had stolen the children, it was true, but that Our Lady had manifested herself. He also saw a sort of luminous globe turning in the clouds. There seemed to be a haze around the holm-oak shrub after the bang. The people complained not only about the administrator but also about the parish priest, saying that he too was to blame. Lúcia's uncle, António da Silva5, wanted that afternoon to go and demand an explanation from the parish priest, believing him guilty, but he did not turn up. Jacinta's father went to see the parish priest, supposing that he knew something about the children. He then went back home with his brother-in-law. The people went on talking against the parish priest, asserting that it was he who was to blame for the abduction of the children. The administrator brought the little ones back on Wednesday the 15th, after Mass, at about eleven o'clock. On Saturday the eleventh, the parents of Lúcia and of Jacinta had been summoned to Ourém, only the fathers and Lúcia going. First they called Lúcia and the parents. Then they called Jacinta's father. The father answered that he had not brought her, because, being so small, she could not go on foot, nor could she ride a donkey. The administrator retorted: “So you're disobeying?!” “No, because here I am,” Manuel Marto stressed. Later, when he came to bring them back to Fátima, he told him that he had already intended to arrest the children on that day. As soon as he arrived he took the children to the parish priest's house. He declared that people were accusing the regedor and the parish priest of the abduction of the children, but that he alone was to blame, that they could ask the children whether they had been ill-treated, and that he no longer wanted anything to do with it, that they could go to the place as often as they liked. What is certain, however, is that on the way back from Ourém he had already told the children that he would arrest them again if they went to the Cova da Iria once more.

Português (original)

Em treze de agosto, foi à fazenda buscar milho com a ideia de lá ir ao local à hora própria, sabendo, quando já estava na eira, pela Florinda3, que o administrador tinha chegado entretanto a sua casa. Ainda não eram dez horas. Voltou logo para casa e encontrou o administrador e um padre4 que não conhecia. O administrador perguntou: “Então, senhor Marto, sabe porque cá venho hoje? Quero lá ir acima à Cova da Iria, ao Milagre, quero ir ver. Sou como S. Tomé, ver e crer”. Manuel Marto disse: “Faz bem, senhor administrador”. Este declarou que levava as crianças no seu carro. Elas ainda andavam com o gado. Marto pediu a sua mulher que as chamasse, porque eram horas. Não chegou a chamá-las, mas elas vieram com o gado. A Lúcia sabendo que o administrador estava em casa dos tios, dirigiu-se logo para lá, e ele, assim que a viu, disse-lhe que as levava de carro, ao que ela retorquiou que não iam de carro. A pequena voltou a casa e depois veio com o pai. Ouviu-se nessa ocasião falar num segredo. Como a estrada não estava feita, o carro ficou à espera numa encruzilhada. O administrador disse que então os esperava na Fátima para lhes fazer umas perguntas em casa do Senhor Prior.

Dirigiram-se os pais das três crianças a casa do Senhor Prior, não estando ainda lá o administrador, que chegou pouco depois. Ficaram todos na varanda. Só a Lúcia foi chamada lá dentro para ser interrogada pelo senhor Prior em presença do administrador.

Depois do interrogatório, o administrador convidou as crianças a descer as escadas da varanda e a subir para a charrete em que tinha vindo, deu uma volta à igreja e fugiu para Vila Nova de Ourém. O pai da Jacinta seguiu então para a Cova da Iria tendo ficado admirado da partida do administrador. Na Cova da Iria, depois de falar com várias pessoas, ouviu perfeitamente um estrondo seguido de poeira e nevoeiro. O povo fugiu. Quase todas as pessoas tiraram os chapéus, gritaram por Nossa Senhora e ficaram muito contentes, dizendo que tinham roubado as crianças, é verdade, mas que Nossa Senhora se tinha manifestado. Viu também uma espécie de globo luminoso girando nas nuvens. Parecia haver uma névoa em volta da carrasqueira, depois do estrondo. O povo queixava-se não só do administrador, como do senhor Prior, dizendo que ele também tinha culpa. O tio da Lúcia, António da Silva5, nesse dia à tarde, queria ir pedir satisfações ao senhor Prior, julgando-o culpado, mas não apareceu. O pai da Jacinta procurou o senhor Prior, supondo que ele sabia alguma coisa a respeito das crianças. Voltou depois com o cunhado para casa. O povo continuava a falar contra o senhor Prior, afirmando que ele é que tinha a culpa do roubo das crianças. O administrador trouxe os pequenos na quarta-feira, dia 15, depois da Missa, cerca das onze horas. No sábado, onze, tinham sido chamados a Ourém os pais de Lúcia e de Jacinta, indo só os pais e a Lúcia. Primeiro chamaram a Lúcia e os pais. Depois chamaram o pai da Jacinta. O pai respondeu que a não trouxera, porque ela, sendo tão pequena, não podia ir a pé, nem sabia ir de burra. Replicou o administrador: “Então desobedece?!”. “Não, porque aqui estou”, acentuou Manuel Marto. Mais tarde, quando as veio trazer a Fátima, disse-lhe que já nesse dia tinha tido tenção de prender as crianças. Logo que chegou levou as crianças a casa do senhor Prior. Declarou que acusavam o regedor e o senhor Prior do rapto das crianças, mas que só ele tinha a culpa, que podiam perguntar às crianças, se as tinham tratado mal, e que já não queria saber de nada, que elas podiam ir ao local, quantas vezes quisessem. O que é certo porém, é que pelo caminho, no regresso de Ourém, já tinha dito às crianças que tornaria a prendê-las se fossem outra vez à Cova da Iria.

Editor's notes (3)

3 Florinda de Jesus, sister of Francisco and Jacinta. Born on 3 August 1902, she died on 20 May 1920, a victim of the pneumonic influenza.

4 Fr. Manuel Carreira Poças.

5 He was married first to Teresa de Jesus, sister of António dos Santos, Lúcia's father.

3 Florinda de Jesus, irmã de Francisco e Jacinta. Nasceu 3 de agosto de 1902 e faleceu a 20 de maio de 1920, vítima da pneumónica.

4 Pe. Manuel Carreira Poças.

5 Foi casado em primeiras núpcias, com Teresa de Jesus, irmã de António dos Santos, pai de Lúcia.

DCF Seleção, Doc. 80 (= DCF II, Doc. 4) · interrogation · 28 Sep 1923 (6 years later)View scans (2)Link
13 SepFirst-handSaw nothingSworn depositionSeers' words overheard
English

On the thirteenth of September he also went to the Cova da Iria. He was some distance from the children. He saw nothing and heard nothing, but heard it said that some people had seen extraordinary things in the sky. He heard the children say that Our Lady would say in October what she wanted and would work a miracle so that all the people would believe.

Português (original)

Em treze de setembro foi também à Cova da Iria. Estava um pouco afastado das crianças. Não viu nada, nem ouviu nada, mas ouviu dizer que algumas pessoas tinham visto coisas extraordinárias na atmosfera. Ouviu dizer às crianças que Nossa Senhora havia de dizer em outubro o que é que queria e havia de fazer um milagre para que todo o povo acreditasse.

DCF Seleção, Doc. 80 (= DCF II, Doc. 4) · interrogation · 28 Sep 1923 (6 years later)View scanLink
13 OctFirst-handPartlySworn depositionCrowd sceneSeers' words overheardPale / silver discSun changing colour
English

On the thirteenth of October it was raining. They advised him not to go because they might do him harm, although they would not do it to the children, since they were children. He went in their company. There were then many people at the place, which had turned into an enormous quagmire. He heard Jacinta shout that they should not crush her. Lúcia said: “She's here!” The people asserted that they saw colours in the sun and in the sky. The sun did not hurt the eyes at all. He heard no voice. He heard it said, either by Lúcia or by other people, that Our Lady wanted Our Lord not to be offended any more, since He was very much offended, and that the war was going to end.

Português (original)

Em treze de outubro chovia. Aconselharam-no a que não fosse porque lhe podiam fazer mal, embora o não fizessem às crianças, por serem crianças. Foi em companhia delas. Estava então muita gente no local convertido num lamaçal enorme. Ouviu a Jacinta gritar que não a apertassem. A Lúcia disse: “Já cá está!” O povo afirmava ver cores no sol e no céu. O sol não fazia nenhuma impressão à vista. Não ouviu voz nenhuma. Ouviu dizer ou à Lúcia ou a outras pessoas que Nossa Senhora queria que não se ofendesse mais a Nosso Senhor, o qual estava muito ofendido e que a guerra ia acabar.

DCF Seleção, Doc. 80 (= DCF II, Doc. 4) · interrogation · 28 Sep 1923 (6 years later)View scanLink